Tragic Arts (Agony & Ecstasy)
Joy. Pump. Pump. Pump it up. Pain.
Matt:Sunshine. And It rains. Listen to the Rob page. Well, I'm a new kid. I'm just coming up.
Matt:I love it. Yep. And then I was thinking about that was that's a that's a that's a kind of an intro to the topic we're gonna do today.
Kristin:Oh.
Matt:Right? And then there's another one I was thinking about. It's another eighties. Right? Meatloaf.
Matt:Remember?
Kristin:I don't.
Matt:And I would do anything
Kristin:Thankful love.
Matt:But I won't do that. I won't
Kristin:do that.
Matt:And it's like the the whole thing is what is it that he won't do for love? And it made me remind us of advice that we give parents, our, clients all the time. That they just say, well, yeah. That's too hard. I would do anything for my kids.
Matt:What's the one thing Yeah. That a parent that if if your years of your years of working in the tragic arts.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:Twenty some years in dealing with families and, children of all ages and stages and capabilities. Do you have a a single rule, a single piece of advice to to tell parents?
Kristin:Listen to your children?
Matt:Have a conversation with them. Talk to them.
Kristin:Get to know them so you can listen to them and hear them.
Matt:Yeah. And then there's
Kristin:Sometimes I ask
Matt:them a question. A client that became a friend that becomes a client. You know, sometimes your clients become friends. But he he came to us and he said, okay. I just need help with my kids.
Matt:Awesome. Yeah. We can help you. Talk to them every day.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Ask them probing questions, not just yes, no's. Yeah. Listen to what they care about.
Kristin:Yeah. Find out what they're dealing with.
Matt:And then he came back months later. Okay. So I've got a very specific thing to, you know, this kid this, this kid that. Woah. Woah.
Matt:Woah. Kristen, stop. Have you done what we asked what we suggested before, which is to talk to your kids every day? Ask probing questions. Yeah.
Matt:That's hard. I said, yes. I agree. It is hard to have conversations with your kids when you aren't truly cognitively invested in their independence.
Kristin:Yeah. That's it.
Matt:And there's a there's a principle of how you view your children and it's really an extension of how you view any other human being. And it's a question of empathy and abstract thinking. Not just do you have empathy for another? Many cruel people utilize the gift of empathy in order to perpetuate their cruelty. Mhmm.
Matt:So don't think of empathy as a pure virtue just like love isn't. It's it's just really the ability to feel what another feels, but there's something different cognitively. Okay? That's feeling. This person has their own feelings and they feel bad, like I feel bad, they feel happy, like I feel bad.
Matt:There's another component to that that's that's maybe even superior, which is this person has their own mind, their own consciousness, their own sense of their own perception, their own sense of existence.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:And it matters. They have value because of their conscious sovereignty and bodily autonomy. So yeah, it's hard to talk to your kids if you don't really view them as interesting beings with conscious sovereignty, their own thoughts or bodily autonomy, their own senses, their own feelings.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:They're boring then.
Kristin:And they also won't talk to you if they feel that from you.
Matt:Right. Why did my kids not talk to me? You stopped talking to them. They didn't stop talking to you. You stop talking to them.
Matt:They didn't stop talking to you.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:I would do anything for my kids. Would you treat them as would you would you empower them to have conscious sovereignty and bodily autonomy? Well, I wouldn't do that. That's pretty hard.
Kristin:That's against my
Matt:We We agree we agree we agree it's a challenge. We agree it's a
Kristin:challenge. Yeah.
Matt:And I you know, the the the the big word, the word that everybody throws around and nobody understands or shares. Right? Yeah. Is it God? That's one.
Matt:Is it love? That's another. But the word is trauma. Mhmm. Trauma, capital t, capital, you know, lowercase t trauma.
Matt:Mhmm. And every person is becoming more and more aware of the the real impacts of trauma. Yeah. So this doesn't come from a false place, this hyper awareness on the impact and effects of of trauma, but it's just we don't we're not precise enough. We're not honest enough about what is and isn't trauma.
Matt:We're getting to a place where we're just calling everything trauma and so then nothing is. Mhmm. Mhmm. If if if everything is a traumatic if everyone has PTSD, then no one does. Because PTSD is a pathology.
Matt:It's a real clinical real thing.
Kristin:Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So With actual measurements
Matt:to diagnose. And it's and it takes some real, real dysfunction and real issues, not just discomfort to to be diagnosed then. It's it's rare ish in Mhmm. Society. And so if everyone's PTSD, no one is.
Matt:Yeah. If everyone can be diagnosed with anxiety, no one is. If everyone has depression, no one is. Everyone's bipolar. Everyone has some form of a spectrum Yeah.
Matt:In a processing disorder, which is a processing order that makes the person feel disordered. Mhmm. But and everyone
Kristin:scale of, like, neurodivergence
Matt:Yes. Everyone's trying to do. DID and bipolar, and and there's just too many diagnose the ADHD is another it's it's it's too ubiquitous. It's too universal. Mhmm.
Matt:And so in the question of trauma that gives you these diagnosis because that's what these these diagnosis have essentially replaced the word trauma. What do you mean trauma? Well, I have anxiety. That's meant to be a step away, and it's really appealing to a profession. My doctor says I do.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:Really why people give you their diagnosis. My doctor says
Kristin:Mhmm. Yeah.
Matt:But I talk when I talk to people and they tell me, well, I've had a lot of trauma. I said, yep. Who who hasn't?
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:So so some of the things you've just described or what you've described so far is the human experience. And then in understanding trauma, we can at least tease it out. Because you said something. You said you heard someone try to define trauma just recently.
Kristin:Yeah. I was gonna read that too.
Matt:Do you remember?
Kristin:I remember it was Dan Siegel.
Matt:Okay. One of these one of these secular prophets again.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:But
Kristin:And he said something about trauma is something about when system something happens and your system is unable to cope.
Matt:Yeah. It's overloaded and you're unable to cope.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:And overloaded with what? Right? Well, stimulation. Mhmm. Neurojuices.
Matt:Right? A a a neuro a neuropsychologist that I work with that's considered an expert, says that trauma is stress that happens too soon, too often, and too intensely. And and that's I think really profound. There's wisdom in in that. Okay.
Matt:What's stress? Stress is conflict. Stress is stress is violence.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:It's why we can can analogize emotional stress, emotional trauma, experiential trauma with bodily physio, you know, trauma. Because I also heard in the world of emotional trauma. It it's not just the bad things that happened to you that did violence to your mind. It's also the creative developmental cool things that children ought to experience that you didn't. Mhmm.
Matt:The loss of what's a typical human experience. We're not saying, hey. You know, wealth driven experiences. We're talking there's certain connecting experiences with loved
Kristin:ones Yeah.
Matt:That too many people don't have. Yeah. This was in both of those where trauma exists. Yeah. And and and what's try trauma?
Matt:Again, trauma is does violence to the mind. It is a mind crime.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:But it it does injury to the psyche, to the mind, to consciousness, to cognitive functioning.
Kristin:Yeah. To your, like, your relationship with self.
Matt:With you. Yeah. Your your relationship to reality in your environment.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:When when when it's it's, you know, when you're really injured, we're really traumatized. Right? You're scarring. Well, that's a that's gonna be a constant physical presence of an event. You lose a finger.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:You you you, you know, are are now low back injury, neck injury, knee injury, hip Walking. Joints, hands, feet.
Kristin:Changes you.
Matt:I am a different person now. This is me now. It's the the, Jim Jeffries bit. Like, when you're sick and you're diarrhea covered in well, I guess this is just me.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:But it's it's that. It's okay. The two the the toothpaste ain't coming back in the tube. The bell ain't being unrung. Genie's out the line turn.
Matt:This is now a different I'm this way now.
Kristin:Yeah. This is yeah. This is me now. This is
Matt:me now.
Kristin:Yeah. For real.
Matt:And it and especially when it relates to there's there's two times when that happens. One I call developmental trauma.
Kristin:Mhmm. Mhmm.
Matt:And that's just stuff we all go through in growing up. In in many way, adverse childhood experiences are a part of developmental trauma. Kids are going to be experience real loss in the in the, you know, ACEs, adverse childhood experiences. It's really a way to say, this is a child who has experienced stress Mhmm. Very early, very intensely and maybe too frequently.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:At these major Or
Kristin:even ongoing.
Matt:Sure. Like
Kristin:Sure. Constant. Yeah.
Matt:Right. And it and it's these children who experience real complex emotions, loss, grief
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Betrayal, terror, rage, Yeah. Yeah. Despair.
Kristin:And aren't able to really process that.
Matt:Right. It's the things that invade. Holy. Right. Right.
Matt:If if the good things that happen to you, and they are, are when you get a really nutritious night sleep.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:When you have a really high end happy experience playing with your friends and loved ones. Right? When you move, when you when you eat good foods with people that are connecting you, you you have an experience. Right? Those experiences that invade, that infected, that that change sleep Yeah.
Matt:Nutrition, diet, movement, and how I relate to another person. Well, that's where trauma is gonna be. Yeah. And so you can really evaluate through the things that invade and infect and have affected
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Sleep. And a lot of people, oh, this is me now. I'm never gonna get the same sleep now that I've seen that, now that I, you know Mhmm. It's like, the movie seven
Kristin:Oh.
Matt:I watched when we were adults. We were married. We were actually traveling, I think.
Kristin:And it That's intense.
Matt:There's a few scenes in that. I was like, I don't want that in my mind. And in work, you're forced to, you know, given the tragic arts that we do, you're forced to read, hear, and watch things you just don't wanna have in there. Yeah. You're changed from it.
Matt:And that's what, like, proxy trauma is. Right? Teachers, first first responders, cops, firefighters, right, doctors. Is they see stuff that just can't be unseen. Yeah.
Matt:Death, sex, drugs, violence, tissue damage, injury, trauma, life altering events. And that's what trauma is. So it's it's it's good to be precise because too often I hear people, okay. I'm I'm anxious. I I have anxiety.
Matt:Okay. Why do you have anxiety? And they go through it and you say, no. That's a that's a human experience. That's what it is to know my worries, the way I worry, and the way I think about things is so much greater or so much beyond anyone else.
Matt:I feel so much greater. Yeah. That's not how world
Kristin:works. Mhmm.
Matt:I know you'd like it to be the case that you win the Trauma Olympics and you feel things great more greater than everyone and you think things more greater than ever. It's unlikely you do. Mhmm. What's probably happening to some people may perceive that they have better resiliency tools than you do. So it feels like yours is more, catastrophic Mhmm.
Matt:Critical.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:It's a bigger emergency. Yeah. And sometimes that's the
Kristin:case. It just what we're gonna
Matt:do is
Kristin:just a lot of a lot of times becomes this crutch then. And it's then it's debilitating.
Matt:Right.
Kristin:Because with the people that are really instead of yes. It's hard to, like, evaluate the trauma that you go through. But if you're not, then it does become, right, that crutch that changes you. Yeah. Instead of with time, obviously, you have to allow time a little bit.
Kristin:But to look back and and and be able to communicate with yourself what just what you went through and at least how it it has made you you to make decisions moving forward, not to be stuck in it Right. Or avoid it because then you you can't be you and make decisions moving forward.
Matt:But a traumatic event, a traumatic experience, a tragedy, it it it instructs, it provides a framework for how we respond to other tragedies. Mhmm. Right? The idea of fight, flight, freeze, flop, fawn, fuck. These, these six ways we tend to survive.
Matt:But we fixate on, like, the freeze and fight because that's, like, imminent threat terror upon me. And we can spend more time in the flight and we think of flight as, oh my gosh, threat upon me. Now I must sprint off this way, but there
Kristin:are
Matt:different ways to flee.
Kristin:Like, I yes. I agree.
Matt:Sometimes you can utilize energy to observe and identify a threat that's in a little more distance so you can prepare and really maybe quickly get stuff together and make sure you have the things that you need and make sure the people that are you're that are responsible you're responsible for have what they need, and then you can start fleeing slowly. And and and this can happen in every form of predator, every form of danger. And and and and it can it starts, I think, what what we can at least avoid today, 2023 practically in in modern America is reduce the amount of crime that is committed against our children.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Your children.
Kristin:Because if if children if we if we don't and children are constantly living in a state of fear and to cause some sort of fight, flight, freeze, fawn.
Matt:Flop.
Kristin:Flop, fuck. Right? But the fight flight freeze does whatever. If if developmentally children are constantly in trauma, the flee one is dangerous because you you can flee thoughts and flee also ways that you do things to stay away from a memory or a feeling. Mhmm.
Kristin:So we can also be fleeing here, which isn't healthy because then it does create, like, you know, disorders and disassociated thinking of how you do react and make decisions.
Matt:Fleeing in the mind while you're wallowing in it in the body.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:And so you're still experiencing it. You're just Yeah.
Kristin:So developmental, you're even making it more tragic because physiologically, it's affecting you too because of the hormones that you are constantly in.
Matt:Right.
Kristin:And, like, making because of the state of flee, fight, flight, whatever.
Matt:And and what I've come to is fear.
Kristin:Kids are scared.
Matt:Yeah. They're scared.
Kristin:Fear.
Matt:But they're scared for a reason. They're scared because they are too often unsafe and unsecure in their own homes. Mhmm. The big secret of life is just how much abuse children are experiencing in every home Yeah. By either parent or
Kristin:sibling Mhmm. Yes.
Matt:In in some way, shape, or form. And we don't appreciate or we're not aware of because so much so much crime isn't intentional. I want my designers to harm this person and to cause as much mayhem.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Most crimes are done recklessly Mhmm. And negligently.
Kristin:Negligently. Yeah.
Matt:And and there's just too much negligent and reckless child abuse happening Exactly. By parents, by teachers, by healers.
Kristin:Or siblings who are supposed to be babysitting and raising them. You're helping, but that it causes harm or can many times.
Matt:Trauma.
Kristin:Trauma.
Matt:Negligent, reckless parenting.
Kristin:Oh, and we were talking about siblings. Oh, anyone. All of the people that can
Matt:And and okay. What's crime? Well, crime is is certainly when there is physical injury and property damage. And we just allow entirely too much physical injury, sexual injury, and, property damage to happen. Let alone when we start getting into the emotional abuse.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:And the harm that children experience in their homes. The the the but all of this is a form of developmental trauma. Like, there's a level of where every kid experiences suffering at the hands of older humans. Mhmm. It's a it's a it's a universal human experience.
Matt:But there does become something where it's just inordinate. It happens too soon when the kid's too young, too intensely, too frequently. Physical abuse, sexual abuse, and and neglect, betrayal. Of what? Of the needs that this child has.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Neglect is in failing to even identify or spend the time trying to find what this kid needs. It's it's it's it's it's it's grabbing a crying kid and always feeding them a bottle, and sometimes you need to change them.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Sometimes they they're cold. Listen to them. Yeah. And we stop doing that. And that's that's neglect.
Matt:And children feel it.
Kristin:Yeah. They do.
Matt:They they they are they are angry. They have complex emotions because they become neglected at some point.
Kristin:And they can tell when they're even as infants, if if they're if there's avoidance in the eye contact and the cooing and in the talking, they're naturally trying to relate with something else. And And there's a lot of when parents are traumatized or going through, you know, issues of stress, then it naturally causes those in issues of, of neglect when you don't even think that you are neglecting.
Matt:But the irony, right, and a lot of more said and isn't it ironic? It's like a traumatic event that saved your life. Right? These trauma experiences, both developmental and abusive and you can really distinguish them between real abuse, like abuse and stuff you just went through. Mhmm.
Matt:And and these are different. You know, I I I say going to a doctor to heal something on your body can be traumatic, but it's part of the healing process. It's part of the growing process. Mhmm. Going to the doctor and having him violate you, right, for his pleasure And he sticks a finger inside you where he shouldn't have.
Matt:He has you stripped down and look at you in certain ways he shouldn't have. That's abuse that shouldn't be a part of the healing process.
Kristin:Exactly.
Matt:And what's happening too often is we're calling the real harsh, real consequential it's all consequential, but it's abuse type stuff normal. We're normalizing it. And we're taking normal trauma and pathologizing it. Saying it's the worst just ever. And and it's in proper properly identifying, the types of trauma.
Matt:It it does matter because because most developmental trauma is a little more simple. It it it it's complex because our brains, our minds are figuring stuff out, But the mind's built to figure out normal human emotions and experiences and unpredictability amongst people. But when that includes physical abuse or terror based yelling or or or sexual touching boundary issues. That's a level of mind distortion. It's just different.
Matt:Mhmm. And the thing is is every child's gonna experience some combination of both. And so as as as adults that have decided that we're gonna be responsible for kids in whatever way, through our jobs or because we had them. It it's our duty to them to give them the tools to navigate the trauma, the abuse, the harm, the stress, and the threats that we ultimately impose on them.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Because of the environments we choose to live, because we choose to move somewhere, because we choose to interact with someone.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Here here's a great, sign of risky, of risky environments. If you have especially either either big families Mhmm. That are either blood families or even families of choice and the children of these people are spending an awful lot of time together in real intimate settings like overnights and things like that. That's a recipe for disaster.
Kristin:Mhmm. Yeah.
Matt:It's a recipe for disaster, for example.
Kristin:For example.
Matt:K. So it's parents duty to arm your kids with the tools to identify and neutralize the threats that you brought to their door and to manage and overcome the stress that you have contributed to and to overcome and mitigate the effects of the abuse that you either caused or allowed to be caused by your negligence. And your good faith your good faith negligence but your negligence notwithstanding. And even the intentional abuse that heaped down because sometimes you were just a cruel, angry, bitter person
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:That took it out on your kid.
Kristin:And we too often expect our children to calm down, change their behavior, be sorry for something they did when we can't even as parents control ours as we're telling them to do it. And it's confusing and insulting and shameful to the child that they don't even get the lesson except this is how we behave and even when I do, I'm in trouble.
Matt:Right.
Kristin:It's just that's all
Matt:they need to do here. High emotions. Yeah. How about you? Yeah.
Matt:Maybe you should have less high emotions and that kid will come down.
Kristin:Yeah.
Matt:So so that's the reality of trauma. Yeah. It's it's bad, but it's not as bad as you probably think. And nobody wins the Trauma Olympics. Anybody who is now identifying with their trauma rather than what it taught them.
Kristin:Well and when you spend time connecting, realizing what your trauma is and connecting to where it you do feel it in your body. It's it was what we've been talking about, the mind body connection. You can you can learn to control that trauma and make it a part of you that allows you to be open to, like, how did that trauma help me in a way that has made me stronger and better? But it it it's it will it resides in our mind and in our body, and we've gotta learn to listen to it and find out why and the whole idea of the trigger. Well, then then if something's triggering you in a way that you need to say that you're triggered somehow, there's something in your mind or body is trying to tell you something and you need to go figure out what it's trying to tell you.
Matt:Mhmm.
Kristin:So things like that won't happen again.
Matt:Where are the threats?
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Where are the threats and what is invading my sleep, my diet, my movement, and my relationships with people? Mhmm. How much so many people sleeps invading their sleep and diet's invading their diet and movement's invading their movement. Relationships are invading the relationships. They're out of whack in all four.
Kristin:Yeah. And It's hard to put Humpty back together right now.
Matt:Together again. Mhmm. But that's at least just a place to start in identifying the threats. But just identifying the the and being aware of a threat enough isn't enough if you can't overcome it.
Kristin:Yeah. And
Matt:there are ways to overcome it. We're gonna teach you about a little thing that, any competent practitioner in the healing arts should be aware of by now, especially anyone who claims to be treating trauma. And we're gonna give it away because there's too many really bad perpetrators who are presenting themselves as healers or teachers or protectors and they're they're just causing harm. So we're gonna teach you about a thing called trust expression therapy. And it's a it's taking things you've heard of and it's actually making them useful.
Matt:So here's a little preview to some some some free therapy I'm gonna give you. Mhmm. If your therapist is doing EMDR therapy for you, you're you're wasting your money. It's a parlor trick. If anybody is claiming to do somatic therapy with you, get your money back, move on to somebody else.
Matt:This is a parlor trick, and this is it's like saying go on a walk or calm down. So if you wanna do EMDR, here's what you do. Go on a walk. But don't have a reason. Don't have a timer.
Matt:Don't have a pace. You're just trying to walk. Mhmm. You're walking through a neighborhood. You can walk around a track, but you're not doing it for time or distance.
Matt:Mhmm. You're just walking. You can do a bite.
Kristin:Just walk around.
Matt:And the point is around you. As you Enjoy. As you walk, you turn your head side to side and
Kristin:Enjoy what's outside.
Matt:The left brain and the right brain starts to alternate and starts to fire. That's what EMDR EMDR does. And that's why they do the little stimulation where you can do buzz buzz buzz buzz buzz buzz, not two. You wanna play around with each other's hands? They need you to touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch, touch.
Matt:K? Sing sing your Tibetan singing bowl. That's kind of the same thing. It's getting the vibration going with auditorily. You can put on stereo headphones and listen to cool, producers that do different things to each side of the brain.
Matt:That's EMDR. Mhmm. It's not that deep. Mhmm. And, yeah, it has a little bit of effect, but it's not gonna do what they say it does alone.
Matt:There's too much clog. There's too much other things going on. You can't it's it's it's it's like getting a quick massage. You know, going to go it's getting it's paying $15, you know, in the massage chair at the mall for ten, fifteen minutes. Yeah.
Matt:It feels better. And then by the time but I ain't gonna work out any of these kinks or these knots. Okay? The other one is somatic work, breath work. Okay?
Matt:Here's the big surprise. Here's the big secret on breath work and somatic therapies. First of all, it also doesn't work for a lot of reasons. Secondly, it triggers really negative, emotions without the ability to put Humpty Dumpty back together again. So good work.
Matt:It's a good thing to do. It's nice to find a way to control the breath, but don't do any more than three or four reps. You shouldn't be doing this for more than a song. Put a song on. Do a little breathing.
Matt:Here it is. Breathing all as much as you can.
Kristin:Deep into your belly.
Matt:Repeat two times. Nose, mouth. I don't care. You can go in through your nose, out through your nose. You go in through your nose, out through both.
Matt:Right now, the point is just to get a lot of the good stuff that's in the atmosphere and the, oxygen and completely fill the lungs and completely expel them three times, four times. Don't do more than four. That's somatic work. And you can do that throughout the day. But if there's somebody that's selling you somatic work or they're having to do these floppy things and you drop on your heels.
Matt:Yeah. You can go up to your you can go up to your tippy toes, hold up high, and then drop and feel the ground into your into your heel through your body. Feel that that's grounding. Right? You can do that.
Matt:That's the
Kristin:MBR. Your energy out.
Matt:That's the MBR. That's that's somatic work. But if that's what your therapist is doing, they're a wook, not a witch. Mhmm. So there you go.
Matt:Trauma is stress that happens too soon, too frequently, and then too intensely. And that can happen from a lot of different ways, not just one thing, and we focus on the one thing. But if we have many things that are stressful all at once, that's a pretty bad day, and that can be traumatic. Doesn't mean you're any different than anybody else, and it doesn't make you who you are. Their personality tests personality tests aren't a thing.
Matt:It's your environment that isn't changing. You're self selecting for the same people in the same locations. You just have different accoutrement, and so your responses, your survival tools are the same. But if you were progressing, if you were healing, you would have more tools, better tools to respond to threats and stress, and you would survive differently than you have been. If those types of therapies worked, it would have worked by now.
Matt:If religion was gonna work, it would have worked by now. If modern psychotherapy, CBT, DBT, EMDR was gonna work, it would have worked by now. And if psychedelic assisted therapy was gonna work, it will work by now. But that doesn't work either, and it's got the same problems. Mushrooms are dangerous.
Matt:We just had a doctor try to take down a plane after doing mushrooms. Ketamine is dangerous and addictive.
Kristin:Mhmm.
Matt:Matthew Perry just died because of his reliance on ketamine. The people who are doing ketamine, it's like going to the fifteen minute massage chair and saying that's going to, solve years
Kristin:Work out my kink. Yeah.
Matt:Of a of a of a bent and misshapen back.
Kristin:Mhmm. Yeah.
Matt:The the they've got it wrong. And people need to move slower on this type of therapy. EMDR, long term, long long duration can be injurious. Breath work, long in in long durations can be injurious. Trying to teach mindfulness or meditation as therapy is injurious.
Matt:Doing psychedelic assisted therapy for healing rather than evolving is injurious. Because all of these things, what they do is they, the the people are experiencing the distortion, the dysfunction of the mind of cognition and these different religion if it would've worked by now. Yeah. It would've. Right?
Matt:It takes someone in their distorted state, in their traumatized state, in their fight flight freeze state, and it gives them more distortion. It hits them in the emotional imagination side of their brains. It activates them and it takes it. They are Beetlejuice. It's any answer to grief.
Kristin:And the the important part of all of these healing therapies is going back to yourself with your logic and reason to apply to analyze, apply reason through that crazy imagine as if thing that you went through, whether it was good or bad. And reason and and, right, analyze, apply so you can move forward with the information or knowledge that you learned out of it. So you've gotta learn something. Yes. Sometimes it's bad, but it allows you to be careful and learn from and, you know, move forward in other ways that allow you to stay safe and secure.
Kristin:So we need to use these stressful experiences with our logical parts of the brain, but it is what you're saying is we get too caught up in that. It's it's too much. The imagination part, the the the crazy experience, the the thoughts that go out of control with the what ifs, and we do not spend enough time as humans really feeling those and and doing that, pulling through. What why did I have to go through that? Well, I how did it make me me?
Kristin:And using those things, that logic part of our brain, and and and this is what Bloom says, you have to analyze and apply before you can put it all together and create, which is moving forward with sound decision making skills. And as humans, we were meant we did go through stress and trauma as early humans trying to just survive. But now that we have the luxury like, we went through them, the luxuries of change, we we should be able to survive without worry in a world with this much. But we're still fighting to survive in ways that are ridiculous.
Matt:And So
Kristin:it's coping and and now we can't even cope through reality.
Matt:And and the reality is is the adults have failed. The children are so so kids. You know? And by that, especially, I mean, 18 to 25 to 27 to 30 year olds. You're gonna have to do it yourself.
Kristin:You are.
Matt:And and and the adults that wanna help their kids, you're gonna have to do it yourself and then you can help them Mhmm. Do it their self. Mhmm. There there is a path, a process, an experience that overcomes trauma. And the result is that you become an adult that has better sleep, better nutrition and metabolism, better movement, and better relationships.
Matt:Mhmm. It's it's it's it really is isn't that deep. It never has been. Or something like that?